Topic: Logistics Training

[SentryMAn]

Logistics Officer Training?

I know it Happens on CFB Borden at CFSAL
How long are the phases and the specialty training?

I'm not able to access the Din site for CFSAL.

Thanks

[NFLD Sapper]

Logistics Officer Training?

I know it Happens on CFB Borden at CFSAL
How long are the phases and the specialty training?

I'm not able to access the Din site for CFSAL.

Thanks

Logistic Officer Common Course (LOCC)

Aim
The aim of this training is to provide logistics officers the core knowledge and skills in leadership, staff work, logistic processes, resource management and personnel administration.


Prerequisites
In order to be selected for this training, the member must have successfully completed or been granted equivalency for:
Basic Military Officer Qualification (AIPB)
Common Army Phase (AIOX) for Army Officers, and Naval

Scope
The course is 35 training days in duration and covers the following Performance Objectives:

PO 001 – Promote Logistics Branch Culture and Traditions
PO 002 – Assist in Managing Logistics Operations
PO 003 – Assist in Managing Deployed Logistics Operations
PO 004 – Perform Military Staff Work and Communications
PO 005 – Manage Military/Civilian Personnel
PO 006 – Conduct Administration Processes
PO 007 – Administer Finance at the Unit Level
PO 008 – Oversee Contracting/Procurement at the Unit Level


If you are army then:

Logistic Officer Common Land (LOCL)

Aim
Advance Training Division is responsible for providing Logistics Officer Course – Land (Phase IV). The aim of this course is to provide the knowledge and skills required by Junior Land Logistics Officers in the performance of their duties as a Platoon Commander within a Close Support (supply, transportation or administration) or General Support Service Battalion.


Prerequisites
In order to be selected for this training, the member must have successfully completed or been granted equivalency for:
Common Army Phase
Logistics Officer Common Course Part I & II (AILJ)
Transportation Management, Supply Officer or AIHS, Pay Accounting Officer (PAO)

Scope
The course currently consists of 47 training days and covers the following Performance Objectives:

PO 001 - Provide Logistics Support for Exercises/Operations
PO 002 - Conduct Tactical Road Moves
PO 003 - Operate in a Field Environment
PO 004 - Direct operations of Command Post During Exercises/Operations
PO 005 - Manage Platoon Equipment, Resources and Personnel

[MJP]

In addition generally you will do your specialty course in between your Ph3 & 4.  The training Excel sheet I have is corrupted or I would put it on here for folks to look at.

Training Days

Transport- 19 days
Supply- 18 days
HR - 25 days
Fin- 15 days
Foods- 18 days

Generally but not always all three courses are done over one summer period to get you qualified.  Folks in the last few years have found their experiences differ due to training back logs & changing courses but it sounds like that is more or less back on track.

A typical summer therefore for an army LogO with his BOMQ(L) would look like this

LOCC 1 Jun-13 Jul
Specialty course 06-15 Aug - 09 Sep
LOCL 12 Sep - 09 Nov

[SentryMAn]

Can you provide the similar information for Air and Sea?

Thank you very much for the information!

[MJP]

Can you provide the similar information for Air and Sea?

Thank you very much for the information!

No as I don't have the training day info for them and don't have DIN access

[Wookilar]

Logistic Officer Common Sea (LOCS)
Aim

The aim of this course is to prepare selected Junior Naval Logistics Officers for the duties they will have to perform as a Ship's Logistics Officer. This course is only one of the prerequisites for the Sea Logistics qualification (AILK). It will normally be followed by 10-12 months of on-job-training on-board ship.

Prerequities

In order to be selected for this training, the member must have successfully completed or been granted equivalency for:

Logistics Officer Common Course Part I & II (AILJ)
Pay Accounting Officer Course (AIHS)
Supply Officer (AJSI)

Scope

This course currently consists of 47 training days and includes:

PO 001 – Perform the Duties of the Head of Department
PO 002 – Deployed Logistics Support
PO 003 – Manage NPF Operations
PO 004 – Manage Food Service Operations
PO 005 – Describe the Supply Operations
PO 006 – Manage the Contamination Control Organization

Logistic Officer Common Air (LOCA)
Aim

The LOCA is the final phase of basic-level officer training for Logistics Officers. LOCA candidates will have completed their Common Air Phase (CAP), followed by their Logistics Officer’s Course, Common (LOCC). The CAP, conducted at the Air Force Academy by Air Force personnel, introduces the officers to operating within the aerospace community. The LOCC, conducted at CFSAL, introduces them to the world of logistics.

LOCA builds upon this foundation by now educating these officers with regards to their duties and responsibilities upon a posting to a Wing, more specifically into a position as a Flt Comd, as of a part of a Mission Support Unit (MSU), as a Squadron Logistics Officer or into a similar position as part of a Wing Logistics Organization. Candidates are educated as to the structures of these units and the support concepts employed by an Air Expeditionary Units (AEU) and MSU in the field. They are introduced to managing human resources, replenishment operations, and financial operations at the squadron level as well as supporting deployed operations. Given the importance of the command post and operating in a field environment, the candidates are also given the theoretical introduction to those tasks.

Upon successful completion of the course, students will have the skills required to cope with their initial employment within a Wing and will possess the ability to continue honing and refining the basic Air Logistician ability they have gained at CFSAL.

Prerequisites

In order to be selected for this training, the candidate must have successfully completed or been granted equivalency for:

Air Log O Env Trg Ph II (10293)
Logistics Officer Common Course Part I & II (AILJ)
Transportation Management, Supply Officer (AIHS), Pay Accounting Officer (PAO), or Human Resource Management

Scope

The course currently consists of 26 training days and includes:

PO 001 - Managing Human Resource Operations at the Squadron Level
PO 002 - Managing Replenishment Operations at the Squadron Level
PO 003 - Managing Finance Operations at the Squadron Level
PO 004 - Provide Deployed Logistical Support at the Squadron Level

[SentryMAn]

Thank you!

[original_brad]

In addition generally you will do your specialty course in between your Ph3 & 4.  The training Excel sheet I have is corrupted or I would put it on here for folks to look at.

Training Days

Transport- 19 days
Supply- 18 days
HR - 25 days
Fin- 15 days
Foods- 18 days

Generally but not always all three courses are done over one summer period to get you qualified.  Folks in the last few years have found their experiences differ due to training back logs & changing courses but it sounds like that is more or less back on track.

A typical summer therefore for an army LogO with his BOMQ(L) would look like this

LOCC 1 Jun-13 Jul
Specialty course 06-15 Aug - 09 Sep
LOCL 12 Sep - 09 Nov

Do you volunteer for these different courses, or are you voluntold. I am army s I realize I'll most likely be looking at transport or supply, but I am hoping to go transport. 

Would you happen to have the different PO's for the specialty courses?

Thanks for so much info so far!

[MJP]

Do you volunteer for these different courses, or are you voluntold. I am army s I realize I'll most likely be looking at transport or supply, but I am hoping to go transport. 

Would you happen to have the different PO's for the specialty courses?

Thanks for so much info so far!

An appropriate time to ask the question as I was filling out my posting and specialty paperwork today.

They ask for your first and second choice among the options.  From what I have gathered that you usually get your first choice.  Keeping in mind that it is the military and if they have too much of one thing, someone will have to take the hit and take their second choice.

I don't have the POs.

[Wookilar]

During my phase training in '09 (I was on the first set of "new" courses to be run), everyone got their choice minus one or two people who ended up pay services (and there was 100 of us on LOCC), so that's a pretty good result.

As for the individual PO's....let me look around, I'll see what I can find.

Wook

edit: Course Content

Tn O

The course currently consists of 20 training days and include:

PO 001 – Manage Surface Lift for Road
PO 002 – Implement MSE Safety Program Acquire and re-market fleet resources
PO 003 – Manage MSE Fleet Resources Manage financial resources

Supply O

This course currently consists of eighteen training day and includes:

PO 001 - Monitor Supply Systems Management
PO 002 - Manage the Requisition and Procurement Process
PO 003 - Manage Warehouse Activities
PO 004 - Oversee Materiel Processing
PO 005 - Conduct SIV/SAV

Pay Accounting Officer

The course currently consists of 10 training days and includes the following Performance Objectives:

PO 001 – Manage the Pay Accounting Process
PO 002 – Process Claims
PO 003 – Administer the Working Capital Fund

[SentryMAn]

My choice would be Supply or Food.

I just love food so it would be a good fit.   

LOL

[original_brad]

During my phase training in '09 (I was on the first set of "new" courses to be run), everyone got their choice minus one or two people who ended up pay services (and there was 100 of us on LOCC), so that's a pretty good result.

As for the individual PO's....let me look around, I'll see what I can find.

Wook

edit: Course Content

Tn O

The course currently consists of 20 training days and include:

PO 001 – Manage Surface Lift for Road
PO 002 – Implement MSE Safety Program Acquire and re-market fleet resources
PO 003 – Manage MSE Fleet Resources Manage financial resources

Supply O

This course currently consists of eighteen training day and includes:

PO 001 - Monitor Supply Systems Management
PO 002 - Manage the Requisition and Procurement Process
PO 003 - Manage Warehouse Activities
PO 004 - Oversee Materiel Processing
PO 005 - Conduct SIV/SAV

Pay Accounting Officer

The course currently consists of 10 training days and includes the following Performance Objectives:

PO 001 – Manage the Pay Accounting Process
PO 002 – Process Claims
PO 003 – Administer the Working Capital Fund

Thanks a ton.

[Macey]

I just love food so it would be a good fit.   

That's what the scale said.... j/k

[SentryMAn]

That's what the scale said.... j/k

Ouch....
I'm only 188lbs and 6' tall.
I'm blessed with high metabolism
haha

[original_brad]

Last summer I finished my CAP course which was run by the infantry school.  Obviously there is going to be a difference between that and borden, but how is the LOCC course?  Is there field time, PT, Rucks, or is it just death by powerpoint for ten weeks?

[Pusser]

My choice would be Supply or Food.

I just love food so it would be a good fit.   

LOL

Generally, you have to a be qualified dietician (or former senior CF cook) in order to become a Food Services Officer.  Having said that, Naval Logistics Officers have more of a hand in food services than the others.  The cooks on board the ship are part of the Logistics Department and so the ship's LogO has to have a reasonable understanding of the field.

[SentryMAn]

Last summer I finished my CAP course which was run by the infantry school.  Obviously there is going to be a difference between that and borden, but how is the LOCC course?  Is there field time, PT, Rucks, or is it just death by Power Point for ten weeks?

From 2010 when I completed the course:
Death by Power point,  A few group PT sessions and no ruck marches.  It would be nothing like CAP at all unless it's severely changed since 2010
The emphasis on my course was team work and relationship building.  Since you will be on the course with other Logo's it a great place to foster some professional relationships and contacts throughout the CF.

[original_brad]

I figured it was going to be death by power point. Thanks for all the info, I will be on my LOCC course this summer, just waiting to graduate and get my posting message.  SentryMan did you do all of your LOGO courses in one summer or did they break it up for you?

[SentryMAn]

I figured it was going to be death by power point. Thanks for all the info, I will be on my LOCC course this summer, just waiting to graduate and get my posting message.  SentryMan did you do all of your LOGO courses in one summer or did they break it up for you?

Started with Ph3(Locc), then Specialty, then Ph4 all back to back, started Jan 2010.

I only did the phase 3 Locc but was loaded on the last two directly after.

Summer in Borden is fun, make sure to bring a Car/motorbike/wheels of some sort.  The cab fare from Base to Barrie can be expensive.

[original_brad]

Right on, yeah I got my truck that i will finally be able to bring to a course, got to short of notice for CAP so had to fly.  By any chance do you have the training schedule for your LOCC course?

[MJP]

Right on, yeah I got my truck that i will finally be able to bring to a course, got to short of notice for CAP so had to fly.  By any chance do you have the training schedule for your LOCC course?

Do you want the powerpoints, training plan, qualification standards and the course staff list too?   I am sure we can dig up some pics of the rooms you will be staying in?  Dude it is a month long basic intro to logistics, having an old course schedule will do nothing for you.

It looks like I will be having a lot of fun this summer mocking people...

[SentryMAn]

Your best bet for the LOCC course is to go on the Din and grab the Military Writing guide, memorize it.
Familiarize yourself with searching the various pubs and docs that are searchable on the din.

Prepare to write a 7hr long "day in the life of" exam on about week 3 that is comprehensive and inclusive of almost anything a logo would encounter on the job.

Read up on some history of logistical implications on famous battles.

Hone your presentation skills.

There isn't much to prepare or make ready for LOCC.  It's an entry level course that will give you a lot of information in a short period of time.  Pay attention in class and try to make friends.

[original_brad]

MJP, your right haha. I'm just bored in school and want to get on with my military career.

Thanks SentryMAN for all the info and advice.

[MJP]

MJP, your right haha. I'm just bored in school and want to get on with my military career.

I hear ya dude.  Just relax and ride the wave. 

[Pusser]

MJP, your right haha. I'm just bored in school and want to get on with my military career.

Thanks SentryMAN for all the info and advice.

You do realize that you're going to the Canadian Forces SCHOOL of Administration and Logistics?  Don't turn your brain off.  You still have some studying to do...

[MJP]

You do realize that you're going to the Canadian Forces SCHOOL of Administration and Logistics?  Don't turn your brain off.  You still have some studying to do...

Wow I don't think it escaped him that that was the case.  Rather like many fourth year students he is getting bored with university studies and wants to get on with his career.  Talking to people in their fourth year of subsidized education it seems that most folks feel that way.

If you are implying that taking the course at CFSAL is the equivalent (and to be fair I don't really know why you posted what you did) of going to university, that is absurd.  They are, as many people know two completely different things.  There are some commonalities but the two lay at different ends of the education spectrum.

[Pusser]

Wow I don't think it escaped him that that was the case.  Rather like many fourth year students he is getting bored with university studies and wants to get on with his career.  Talking to people in their fourth year of subsidized education it seems that most folks feel that way.

If you are implying that taking the course at CFSAL is the equivalent (and to be fair I don't really know why you posted what you did) of going to university, that is absurd.  They are, as many people know two completely different things.  There are some commonalities but the two lay at different ends of the education spectrum.

I understand that.  However, one of the things that has been noticed at CFSAL, particularly amongst the ROTP folks on summer training, is that there is a tendancy to treat university study as "real" and training at CFSAL as not much more than a hindrance of one's summer vacation.  The reality is that CFSAL deals specifically with one's profession and so is pretty important.  If you don't take CFSAL seriously, the consequences will be serious.  If you don't learn to wade through the QR&O, CFAO, DAOD, FAM, etc effectively, it really doesn't matter how well you did at university.

The poster to whom I was responding said he was getting tired of school.  I was simply pointing out that school is not going to end just because he has a shiny new degree in hand.  There's more to come and although some can argue that the work will be easier, I would argue that the expected performance will be higher

[SentryMAn]

I went through CFSAL in the log O program.

It was harder then any university course(other then my CS courses) and was easily hands down the toughest exam I have ever completed.

7 hour exams are excruciating to write, glad I only needed to write it once.

[MJP]

I understand that.  However, one of the things that has been noticed at CFSAL, particularly amongst the ROTP folks on summer training, is that there is a tendancy to treat university study as "real" and training at CFSAL as not much more than a hindrance of one's summer vacation.  The reality is that CFSAL deals specifically with one's profession and so is pretty important.  If you don't take CFSAL seriously, the consequences will be serious.  If you don't learn to wade through the QR&O, CFAO, DAOD, FAM, etc effectively, it really doesn't matter how well you did at university.

The poster to whom I was responding said he was getting tired of school.  I was simply pointing out that school is not going to end just because he has a shiny new degree in hand.  There's more to come and although some can argue that the work will be easier, I would argue that the expected performance will be higher

Fair enough.  I am in the same category as original_brad in that I just want to get on with it.  I don't equate CFSAL to university, but rather the start of professional training.  It certainly is not meant to be taken lightly but rather with a view of furthering professional knowledge within the logistics field.

[original_brad]

I was more saying I'm sick of university, not learning.  I just want to get on with it, actually learn something that will be useful in my career instead of another random university course that has nothing to do with what I will be doing in the forces.  I consider university my time off from summer courses  .

I also just bought What the Thunder Said: Reflections of a Canadian Officer in Kandahar, supposed to be a great book for insight into the world of Log. Any one read it?

[Wookilar]

SentryMAn has a number of good suggestions, and his point on difficulty level is spot on.

LOCC is like being fed with a firehose. The exam sucks, hard. The time constraints you will be under, you have likely never experienced before (even if you had served in the ranks or in a previous trade).

You will work long days, you will have a great deal of homework and reading to do and you will have group work/presentations to do as well. If you are not proficient in powerpoint or comfortable speaking in front of large, potentially very critical crowds, try and work on that.

Let's put it this way, we had multiple ex-WO Chief Clerks on my course, they found the course and the testing to be challenging. One ex-MCpl failed and was sent home.

Is the course do-able? Absolutely, or I wouldn't be sitting here in the position I currently hold. I was a Veh Tech previously. I knew how to look through parts book and repair manuals, but CFAOs and DAODs were pretty foreign to me (other than 9-13 lol).

My advice, have a look through stuff like this. You don't have much time apparently lol:
http://www.admfincs.forces.gc.ca/cfa-oaf/index-eng.asp

As for the networking comments, truer words were never spoken. Not a week goes by that I am not emailing someone that I went to course with, especially LOCC. I am a TN guy, so my Fin and Sup are not the best, but I know lots of people that did take those specialties. We help each other out all the time.

Just be prepared as best you can, but don't get uptight. The staff will give you more  than enough rope.

Wook